night with GB
photos. ga
(Bert) Unsolved
Mysteries show to Oct. 5 from a December date.....
(Bert) Do you
think the reason for this is to get the jump on ....
(Bert) your
documentary? Also, I understand you are
one of 3 producers...
(Bert) doing the
Oct 14 show. Was there much argument between the 3 of you.... TRANSCRIPT:
COMPUSERVE CONFERENCE
GUEST: Tracy
Torme
-----------------------------------------
5:09:53 PM MST
Sunday, September 18, 1988
(Dale) We burning
MUFON cards tongight?
(Steve G)
Greetings, Marge!
(Drax) Now, now,
Dale.
(Drax) <Mine
is in the bottom of my bird cage> GA Marge
(Bert) Hi Marge.
(Mike) Gerry-
read UFO Crash at Aztec
(mjc) !Hi, all.
(Gerry) I have
it. Will start it immediately, Mike.
(Dale) Hi Ms.
Mufon, how are you.
(Drax) By the
way, "C" is hexadecimal for 12, so we have MJ-12 online tonite.
User User ID
Nod Rm Name / Forum Area
---- ------------
--- --- -----------------
31
76374,303 PNX 5
Steve G
49
76703,266 WBR 5
G-WIZ
61
71605,2013 SFM 5
Gerry
63
75376,1620 CVK 5
Dale
93
72135,424 PNX 5
Drax
95
71450,3504 ANN 5
Bert
98
71340,276 SOR 5
Mark
103 73405,1357
PNX 5 Jim
107 73720,362
FYN 5 Jim Parker
108 75340,2642
TSA 5 mjc
109 75116,201
FTW SIG
111 70511,17
CRZ 5 Mike
123 71545,1760
DEQ 5 Rick
128 74270,3360
BOI 5 DON
(G-WIZ) ha!
(Bert) Marge,
have you really resigned from MUFON?ga
(Drax) OK, our
guest is here. Kevin: Type /HAN Tracy Torme
(Guest) Sorry for
the delay.
(Drax) s'alright.
(Drax) OK, formal
conference rules now in effect....
(G-WIZ) change
the name to Tracy please.
(Drax) Please
type a question mark <?> or exclamation point <!>...
(Drax) and please
try to keep lines less than 72 characters...
(Drax) makes it
easier for us to read....
(Drax) Tracy
Torme is a Peabody-award winning filmwriter in...
(Drax) Hollywood.
He is currently working on several projects,...
(Drax) including
the upcoming October 14th documentary,...
(Drax) "UFO
COVER UP: What Does the Government Know"...
(Drax) <at
least that's the title I was told, Tracy>....
(Drax) he has
also just completed the script for the motion picture...
(Drax) "Fire
in the Sky" about the famous Travis Walton abduction....
(Drax) among
other things contemplated for the documentary,...
(Drax) Tracy has
done extensive research and interviews on the Gulf
Breeze affair.
(Drax) He wants
it to be known that...
(Drax)
contractually he can't discuss the actual TV...
(Drax) segments
in detail, and may not be able to answer all your....
(Drax) questions
regarding the show, and apologizes for it, but...
(Drax) I know he
has some interesting things to say anyway. Tracy, any...
(Drax) opening
comments? GA
(Tracy Torme)
Just a moment...
(Tracy Torme)
Thanks, Jim. It's UFO Coverup? Live!, by
the way.
(Drax)
<starting queue, hold for Tracy>
(Drax) OK. When
finished, please use "GA" by the way. GA
(Tracy Torme) GA
(Drax) OK, Don?
(DON) Alright....
(DON) Tracy, on
Paranet Alpha, and here on CIS...
(DON) Jim Speiser
has placed several uploads concerning you...
(DON) and has
stated that you are approx. 99 percent..
(DON) sure that
GB is legit......
(DON) He said you
stated that you are holding...
(DON) out one
percent on the off chance of a hoax, however...
(DON) you feel
sure that it is on the up and up.
...........
(DON) OK,
why? ga
(Tracy Torme)
First let me say that I started out as a complete skeptic
on the case...
(Tracy Torme) I
have come around, little by little to the conclusion
that it _is_...
(Tracy Torme)
almost certainly real. I base this on a
number of things,
including...
(Tracy Torme) my
respect for Hopkins and Maccabee, the number of excellent
first-hand ...
(Tracy Torme)
witnesses, the lie-detector and PSE results, and my personal
feelings...
(Tracy Torme)
regarding the integrity of Ed and his family GA
(Drax) OK, Bert,
GA
(Bert) ok...
(Bert) Tracy, I
know you just spent some time in GB just recently...
(Bert) Can you
tell us if there has been any activity at all...
(Bert) since Ed's
May sighting-abduction....
(Bert) Also can
you report anything about the regressions that are...
(Bert) going
on. Is it true that all the regressions
are being video taped? ga
(Tracy Torme) OK
Bert -- Very little activity since 5/1/88...
(Tracy Torme)
There are some abduction elements involved with nearly a
dozen witnesses...
(Tracy Torme) but
most of this is being explored now and the results aren't
in yet. GA
(Drax) OK, gang,
please keep your questions brief, and...
(Drax) Kevin, or
Tracy, whoever is typing,...
(Drax) please
press ENTER at about 60-70 characters. Jim, GA
(Jim) In Phil
Klass's recent book he says that Dr. Howard...
(Jim) Kandell was
provided a urine specimen that Travis's...
(Jim) brother
Duane said was the first voided by Travis...
(Jim) upon his
return. ...
(Jim) The
analysis of the specimen showed no trace of...
(Jim) acetone,
which the Dr. found perplexing since...
(Jim) Travis
claimed he had lost 10 pounds during his...
(Jim) 5-day
absence. Lack of food for the period
claimed...
(Jim) should have
resulted in acetone in his urine. ...
(Jim) Can you
comment on this contradiction in the...
(Jim) physical
evidence?...GA
(Tracy Torme) My
understanding is that there _were_ acetone traces...
(Tracy Torme) in
his blood but I'm not sure of all details on that aspect...
(Tracy Torme) I
don't think Kandell became involved until a little...
(Tracy Torme)
later in the sequence of events. GA
(Jim) Duane said
he had taken the s[ecimen almost immediately
(Jim) after
travis's return.. GA
(Drax) Any
response, Tracye?
(Tracy Torme)
Don't believe this to be the case. I'll
find out for you. GA
(Drax) OK.
(Jim) OK thanks..
(Drax) Tracy, I'm
sure you know there are a lot of rumors and bad press...
(Drax) going
around the country about the GB case. There are also a...
(Drax) couple of
people speaking out on the case with less than...
(Drax) verifiable
facts. Do you have any comments on stories such as...
(Drax) the one
about the Devil photo, which was rumored to be a...
(Drax) double
exposure hoax by Ed? Or his "prison term"? GA
(Tracy Torme)
There was no devil photo. This is
typical of the ...
(Tracy Torme)
misinformation going around. Photo in
question was ...
(Tracy Torme)
taken at Halloween party and had nothing to do with double-...
(Tracy Torme)
exposure. Don't wish to comment on other
question except...
(Tracy Torme) to
say that it too has been presented in misleading fashion. GA
(Drax) OK, Steve,
have at it. GA
(Steve G) First,
Tracy, a belated WELCOME to CI$ . . .
(Steve G) Next, I
was wondering, are you not in a similar position . . .
(Steve G) as
Whitley Strieber, bein a Science Fiction writer? . . .
(Steve G) I do
not mean to question your credentials, . . .
(Steve G) just
remind everyone (including me) that you are . . .
(Steve G) Fairly
famous in the Science Fiction area. GA
(Drax) GA Tracy
(Tracy Torme)
Thanks for the welcome, Steve. I'm
currently a writer/producer ...
(Tracy Torme)
soon to be director (hopefully). Sci-fi
is something i...
(Tracy Torme)
enjoy and have recently been working in...
(Tracy Torme)
However, I don't consider myself a sci-fi writer per se. GA
(Steve G) May I?
(Drax) Please do.
(Steve G) To
clarify my question, then . . .
(Steve G) Do you
consider yourself more of a Science Fiction . . .
(Steve G)
Writer/Producer, or UFOlogist? Just want
to be sure of the answer GA
(Tracy Torme) Am
somewhat uncomfortable with either term...
(Tracy Torme) i
consider myself a film-maker who's been ...
(Tracy Torme)
lucky enough to utilize some of my personal ...
(Tracy Torme)
passions in my work. Hope that answers
your question. GA
(Steve G) Thank
you and goodnight! GA
(Drax) It should
be said that Tracy has been researching UFOs for longer...
(Drax) than he
has been writing sci-fi professionally (I think). Before...
(Drax) this he
was <dare I say it?> a comedy writer! <Grin> Dale? GA
(Dale) Thanks
Draxter.....
(Dale) Speed
typing lessons after the Co.....
(Dale) As a side
note, on Saturday night at the Cleveland NUFOC
(Dale) Conference,
Dr. Willy Smith of CUFOS, MUFON, and UFO UNICAT
(Dale) fame was
very critical of the GB case. He went
over the videos,
(Dale) photos,
and was critical of Maccabbee and Andrus.
It will
(Dale) be
interesting to see where this goes. I
taped it aand will
(Dale) get it on
line. Lastly, have you spent time with
Walton, and
(Dale) what are
your feelings on the case and the man?ga
(Tracy Torme)
I've been to Snowflake four times and have spent ...
(Tracy Torme)
alot of time with almost all concerned...
(Tracy Torme) i
have a great affinity for Travis and ...
(Tracy Torme)
needless to say I support his contentions...
(Tracy Torme)
Think this case was terribly botched by ...
(Tracy Torme)
Ufologists. I believe W. Smith is to GB
what
(John LEar) Great,
whats going on
(Tracy Torme)
Spaulding was to Walton case...
(Drax) OK,
remember, formal rules in effect....
(Drax) thanks
Tracy, next is Rick, then Marge. GA Rick.
(Rick) Tracy,
even more facinating than the actual phenomena is this...
(Rick) government
coverup. Under what conditions do you think the ...
(Rick) might
rethink their position on this and ...
(Rick) start
releasing some of the amassed data they have...
(Rick) in their
possession. GA
(Drax) GA Tracy
(Tracy Torme)
Unfortunately Rick, I wouldn't hold your breath. GA
(Rick) OK thanks
and I won't!ga
(Drax) Marge, GA
(mjc) Tracy, Jim
S. says that a great deal of info in support of GB is not ...
(mjc) being made
public. Why not- in light of all the
disagreement by
(mjc)
UFOlogists? Also, is Don Ware appearing
on the 14th documentary?
(Tracy Torme) Yes
Marge, I believe he is. Much info
withheld due...
(Tracy Torme) to
privacy constraints as well as fear of ridicule. GA
(Drax) OK, Bert,
GA
(Bert) ok...
(mjc) What is the
role of former astronaut Brian O Leary in the GB casse?
(Bert) Tracy, I
understand that NBC has moved up their air time of their....
(mjc) He was on
the Late Show Fri
(John LEar) I
dont want to interupt . Is this ok?
(Bert) regarding
how to pitch the tone? ga
(Drax) Answer
Berts first, then Marges.
(Tracy Torme)
Think I got two questions at once...
(Tracy Torme)
Marge -- Think O'Leary is interesting guy but don't know...
(Tracy Torme)
anything about GB involvement...
(Tracy Torme)
Bert -- Yes, I do think that's why they jumped...
(Tracy Torme)
ahead several months. Also "pitch
the tone"? GA
(Drax) Yeah,
"pitch the tone"?
(Bert) any
particular slant?ga
(Tracy Torme) We
disagree most of the time. <grin> GA
(Drax) OK, Gerry,
GA
(Gerry) ok...
(Gerry) Tracy,
there are now 3 films (I belive) in the making
(Gerry) and 2 tv
documentaries coming up in October. Are
we finally
(Gerry) entering
a period of greater media coverage of UFOs, and if
(Gerry) we are,
don't you think enough of this would elicit some sort
(Gerry) of change
of our government's official position of silence? ga
(Drax)
<showoff> GA Tracy
(Tracy Torme) You
type almost as fast as me!...
(Tracy Torme)
Hope we'll see more quality UFO stuff but I ...
(Tracy Torme)
think the public's interest comes and goes...
(Tracy Torme)
Think "the conspiritors" realize this GA
(Drax) OK...
(Drax) Next is
John Lear. GA John
(John LEar) Thnks
and Hi Trcy. Is the important role of the cattle mutilations
going
(John LEar) to be
addressed having people like Lou Girodo and Tex graves tell
their
(Drax) John got
knocked offline
(MIB) we got
him!!
(Drax) standby...
(Drax) he
says..."tell their case....also about Grudge 13, I just met...
(Drax) with Bill
English and he is willing to come forward at this time."...
(Drax) Any
comment, Tracy?
(Tracy Torme) Got
worried there for a moment...
(Tracy Torme)
Thought John had been eaten by the aliens ...
(Tracy Torme) and
lizard men that live in a secret underground...
(Tracy Torme)
base beneath his house...
(Aliens) John
gives us gas!!!
(MIB) Watch it
Tracy, YOUR NEXT
(Tracy Torme) We
_will_ be mutilating cattle live on the air...
(Tracy Torme) and
serving them as steaks for the tv critics GA
(Mike) speaking
of bases...
(Mike) do you
have an opinion...
(Mike) on the
reality of the ...
(Mike) UFO Base
in N.Mex...
(Mike) as
reported by Bennewitz?
(Tracy Torme)
I've been to Dulce and met with P.B....
(Tracy Torme) in
his New Mexico office. Strange man,
strange ...
(Tracy Torme)
place. Think something is definitely
going on
(Tracy Torme) in
northern New Mexico, but think elaborate stories
(Tracy Torme) of
underground bases are probably untrue and certainly ...
(Tracy Torme)
fall neatly into the hands of the forces of disinformation
(Drax) OK, Don of
ParaNet Rho, your up. GA
(DON) OK...
(DON) Tracy, you
eariler mentioned that the public interest
(DON) comes and
goes. Dont you think this may be
(DON) because of
the irresponsible manner in which the "Media"
(DON) treats the
subject? Any "soft" story such
as a
(DON) town in
Wisc. building a UFO landing pad is covered...
(DON) and things
such as overflights of military bases are ignored....
(DON) the public
per say never get the real story. I
propose that it
(DON) is as much
a fault of media as the elements in the govt that
(DON) suppress
the story. and follow up. ga
(Drax) GA Tracy.
(Tracy Torme) Don
-- agree with you 100%. Right on the
nose...
(Tracy Torme) a
refreshing point of view. GA
(Drax) Follow Don
GA
(DON) Couple of
weeks ago, myself and another MUFON investigator
(DON) Dale Wedge
proposed attempting to get both pro and con
(DON) elements
together in an attempt for a "trial" to try
(DON) the
evidence in a court setting. If people
such as Klass
(DON) and ciscop
would be willing to enter such a setting
(DON) with people
such as Imbrogno , Speiser, Lear, Mcabee
(DON) would you
be willing to produce such an attempt if it would occure? ga
(Tracy Torme)
Good idea. But beware. Showtime's...
(Tracy Torme)
"trial" of JFK assassination "proved" L.H. Oswald...
(DON) EXACTLY
(Tracy Torme)
acted alone. Ha Ha.GA
(Drax) no, Tracy,
it proved he pulled the trigger....
(Drax) a separate
poll of the jurors afterwards...
(Drax) proved
that he DIDN'T pull it alone. ...
(Drax) John Lear
is next. GA
(John LEar) Thanks. What about the Grudge/13 papers. I
just spent 2 days with
(John LEar) Bill
English and contrary to what several others have said, those
(John LEar)
papers and Bills synopsis of them was accurate.
He is willing to
(John LEar) come
forward at this time and stat his case and debate ANYBODY.
(John LEar) GA
(Tracy Torme) If
English is willing to come to us with...
(Tracy Torme)
substantial evidence, there is still time to change the show...
(Tracy Torme) GA
(Drax) Follow up,
John?
(Drax) OK...
(Drax) John got
knocked off again...
(Drax) "what
kind of substantial proof would you like" he asks.
(Tracy Torme)
Hungry lizards...GA
(Drax) Hahah
(Drax) OK,...
(Drax) Jim is next, then Marge, then WEdge
(Drax) GA Jim
(Tracy Torme)
Something a little beyond "I saw it,and you'd...
(Tracy Torme)
better believe me. Some evidence would
be nice. GA
(Jim) Just a
observation on something said earlier
(Jim) There is a
certain irony in the percieved
(Jim) need to
withold info on GB and other cases...
(Jim) while condeming
the Gvt for doing same. GA
(Drax) Response,
Tracy?
(Tracy Torme) I
think that's a flawed analogy...
(Tracy Torme) The
gov. isn't withholding because of sensitivity...
(Tracy Torme)
toward people's privacy. GA
(Jim) That is not
the only reason given for withholding..
(Jim) on the part
of UFologist.
(Drax) Can you
elaborate, Jim?
(Jim) Often there
are claims..
(Jim) that they
don't want to give out too much..
(Jim) because
they want to use the info...
(Jim) to verify
later cases....
(Jim)
Unfortunately, there may never be similar later...
(Jim) cases so
the fact that the info...
(Jim) is never
verified later simply never comes out.ga
(DON) Not to
mention writing other books!
(Drax) Tracy?
(Tracy Torme)
Agree that GB is a freakish case that may never ...
(Tracy Torme) be
repeated. GA
(Drax) OK, Marge?
(mjc) and did not
receive much enthusiasm. I hope the Oc.t
14th program...
(mjc) makes the
UFO subject credible, because UFOlogists certainly haven't
(mjc) been doing
a very good job of that lately. Got to
leave you. Have a
(mjc) hungry
alien to feed. Thanks, Tracy! ga
(Drax) We lost
your first line Marge,....
(Drax) what did
not receive much enthusiasm?
(mjc) !The idea
of a trial of the UFO subject, which was brought up...
(mjc) to the
MUFON P.I.P.E. Committee during the Wash. D.C. symposium. ga
(Drax) No, it did
go over like a lead balloon, but I still think...
(Drax) its
viable. Next is Dale. GA
(Drax) Bye Marge,
thanks!
(mjc) off
(Wedge) Just a
follow on the Trial. Tracy mentioned
Showtime, but I did
(Wedge) not see
what he said. The question is: If Don
and I were
(Wedge) too
contact both sides, come up with cases, people to debate,
(Wedge) and
lawwyers from each side, would someone be interested in
(Wedge) producing
such an endeavor that you know of?ga
(Drax) GA Tracy
(Tracy Torme)
Could be. I think it's an idea of...
(Tracy Torme)
merit, but a hard one to sell. Can't ...
(Tracy Torme)
make a judgement without knowing more. GA
(Drax) Could it
be sold to Showtime? Any idea of how succesful...
(Drax) the Oswald
trial was? I know I couldn't tear myself...
(Drax) away from
it. GA
(Tracy Torme) Not
too successful. Cut down several
hours...
(Tracy Torme) for
American release. Euro version much
more...
(Tracy Torme)
complete. GA
(Drax) My gosh,
six hours is "cut down"? Oh well...we can...
(Drax) talk about
the trial later...
(Drax) I'd like
to get into another aspect of the documentary...
(Drax) First, can
you tell us what the general segments will cover? GA
(Tracy Torme) I'd
rather answer specific questions...
(Tracy Torme) To
make a list would be inappropriate considering...
(Tracy Torme)
non-disclosure pact. GA
(Drax) OK, just
tell me if we get too specific then...
(Drax) Can you
tell us anything about how much MJ-12 material...
(Drax) or other
"deep blue" stuff will be covered? GA
(Tracy Torme) As
much as we can get our hands on...
(Tracy Torme)
providng we can do some verification work...
(Tracy Torme) on
the sources involved. GA
(Drax) OK. Bert,
GA.
(Bert) ok...
(Bert) Could you
elaborate a little on your...
(Bert) comment
about Dulce (Bennewitz) and that "something definitly is going ...
(Tracy Torme)
Sure. I think New Mexico is a place of
...
(Tracy Torme)
great importence in the UFO mystery...
(Tracy Torme)
Dulce is obviously a place where some...
(Tracy Torme)
unusual sightings and possibly even some ...
(Tracy Torme)
mutilations have taken place...
(Tracy Torme) On
a personal level, I know that I
(Tracy Torme)
instinctively felt that Dulce...
(Tracy Torme) is
an area of high-strangeness...
(Tracy Torme) As
to why, that's anybody's guess...
(Tracy Torme) And
I do mean "guess". GA
(Drax) OK,
(Drax) Don is
next.
(DON) Tracy, do
you have an address where
(DON) we could
send the proposal? ga
(Tracy Torme)
5555 Melrose Blvd. L.A. ..
(Tracy Torme) not
sure of zip (mental block)...
(Tracy Torme) but
it's Paramount Studios and my office #...
(Tracy Torme) is
402 in the hart bldg. GA
(Drax) Dale next.
GA
(Wedge) Tracy,
just wanted to mention that I've seen
your dad 3 times
(Wedge) in
concert. I was under 30 and find him to
be one of the best
(Wedge)
entertainers I've seen. Second, will
there be any Anti-UFO
(Wedge) people on
the show, such as Klass, Shaeffer,
Oberg, etc?ga
(Tracy Torme)
Thanks, Wedge. I'm under thirty
too,(just...
(Tracy Torme)
barely). Unfortunately there will be
anti-ufo...
(Drax) (Oh, did
we go metric?)
(Tracy Torme)
clones on the show. Understand -- I'm
not against
(Tracy Torme)
honest skepticism, I just haven't found much ...
(Tracy Torme) of
it. GA
(Drax) Gerry,
your up. GA
(Gerry) ok...
(Gerry) I take it
there is a military installation at Dulce which mere
(Gerry) civilians
may not enter. When you say you've been
to Dulce, do
(Gerry) you mean
that you gained entry to the installation?
ga
(Tracy Torme)
What installation? As far as I know...
(Tracy Torme)
that's a rumor, and rumors are hard to enter. GA
(Drax) OK, Mike
is next, then we have to wrap. Mike?
(Mike) ok...
(Mike) time
/channel on the ...
(Mike) west coast
for the 10/14 doc...
(Mike) and do you
"believe" in crashed saucers?
(Tracy Torme)
West coast?Ga
(Drax) Its not
"network," Mike.
(Mike) Bay
area.ga
(Mike) Then
where?
(Tracy Torme)
Time is 8p.m. Don't know station...
(Tracy Torme) I
do believe in the Roswell crash...
(Tracy Torme) and
possibly in Laredo crash...
(Tracy Torme)
Crash stories . GA
(Wedge) San
Agustin?
(Drax) Tracy,
would it be possible for LBS to send ParaNet a list...
(Drax) of
stations carrying the program, sometime before it airs? GA
(Tracy Torme)
Don't even think Bill Moore believes
(Tracy Torme) San
Augisten location anymore...
(Tracy Torme) Believes
it to have occured in two ...
(Tracy Torme)
different places on same vast ranchland...
(Tracy Torme)
Drax -- I'll see what I can do. GA
(Drax) Pershitate
it, Tracy.....
(Drax) Thank you
for joining us tonight, its been enlightening...
(Drax) oh, two
quickies, you have a release out this week, don't you? and...
(Drax) when is
"Fire in the Sky" due out? GA
(Tracy Torme)
Thanks for having me GA
(Tracy Torme)
Yes. i wrote original screenplay called
...
(Tracy Torme)
"Witching Hour". It opens this
Friday entitled...
(Tracy Torme)
"spellbinder". Story has been
changed so much I barely...
(Tracy Torme)
recognize it, yet most charetors are still mine. Hope it won't
be...
(Tracy Torme) too
bad. "Fire in the Sky" is just
going...
(Tracy Torme)
into pre-production and should be out within a year...
(Tracy Torme)
Also, do I have time to comment on Rumor mill? GA
(Drax)
Absetively, posolutely. GA
(Tracy Torme)
There are people in UFO circles who
(Tracy Torme)
have been spreading rediculous rumors about
(Tracy Torme)
upcoming show. Should you hear such
stories...
(Tracy Torme)
floating around, _please_ take with grain of
(Tracy Torme)
salt. Most have absolutely no basis in
fact...
(Tracy Torme)
Getting people to take this vitally importent...
(Tracy Torme)
subject seriously is hard enough. Let's
not...
(Tracy Torme)
allow the inmates to start running the asylum...
(Tracy Torme)
Thanks everyone, Tracy. GA
(Wedge) Thanks
Tracy
(Drax) Thanks
again, Tracy....
(Jim) Many
thinaks
(Mike) Yea Tracy
(Drax) And our
thanks also to Kevin Bacchus for...
(Drax) supplying
the CIS access...
(Drax) Kevin: GET
THAT BOY A MODEM!!!
(Drax) Take care,
and goodnight.
(Wedge) Way to go
Kevin!
(Bert) Thanks
Tracy, Night.
(Tracy Torme)
Bye, all.
(Drax) This has
been a production of The Issues Forum
(Drax) Your
moderator was Jim Speiser
(Drax) A Georgia
Griffith Presentation
(Drax) MJ-12 has
paid for the promotional announcement.
(Drax) This is
Don Pardo. Goodnight.
(DON) WOW
(Wedge) Playing
the MIB was Don Ecker!
(Wedge) Playing
Aliens was Dale B. WWWedge
(Wedge) Playing
Phil Klass was a Horse's , well you know.
(Wedge) Hey, does
anyone know about Willey Smith?
(Drax) Wish John
Lear had stayed online. Funny that every time...
(Drax) he started
typing, he got knocked off. I suspect, tho, it...
(Drax) had nought
to do with MIBs.
(Drax) unless
MIBS stands for Modem In Bad Shape
(Bert) Still
funny tho isn't it?
(DON) for all
that are interested
(DON) got a nice
debate going in Paranet RHO...
(DON) call area
code 208-338-9187, tell em Don Sent Ya
(Drax) plug plug
(Drax) About the
trial...
(Drax) Lemme send
you guys the proposal I did two years ago...
(Drax) see if you
get any ideas from that...
(Drax) don't be
discouraged by the PIPE committee results. That was...
(Drax) a very bad
presentation on my part. GA
(DON) Well,
may;be we will
(DON) sacrifice a
virgin. (if we find one)
(Bert) What about
Willy Smith, Dale?
(Wedge) Have you
been asked to be on the program Drax?
(Drax) No, I
don't have anything to contribute on the front lines,...
(Drax) I get
everything second hand. If there was a debate, I might be...
(Drax) asked, but
thats about it. GA
(Wedge) About
Willy....
(Wedge) he did a
number on Gulf Breezes. I was wondering
if...
(Wedge) he had
SOLID connections with either CUFOS or MUFON.ga
(Drax) Dale,
Moseley told me not to tell anyone that Willy...
(Drax) was going
to do a hatchet job on Gulf Breeze, precisely because..
(Drax) he IS in
MUFON. Didn't want to suffer the same fate as Boyd. GA
(Wedge) I was
just wondering where Smith's allegiance was....
(Wedge) if with
CUFO'S, this could be significant...
(Wedge) if with
MUFON, I can see another crucifixion coming....
(Drax) His
allegiance is to the truth, I think. Fiercely independent.
(Wedge) I'll get
the tape and make up the transcript of it....
(Wedge) it was
wild.ga
(Drax) Did he do
a convincing job data-wise, or was it just...
(Drax) "this
looks hokey"?
(Wedge) I could
not attend due to the little duffer, but Rick taped
(Wedge) it and
told me that he went into great detail on the video, the
(Wedge) pictures
and how Macabbee did a bad job on that,
(Wedge) and the
amotives behind Andrus being eeiither duped by a hhoax,
(Wedge) or blind
because he wants to write a book to be
likee the
(Wedge) big
guys. I see many ramifications from this
one.ga
(Drax) Yes,
indeedy. The dust is still being kicked up, and ...
(Drax) will be
for a long time. What's amazing is this...
(Drax) usually,
you either have a Meier-type thing, with lots of negatives ...
(Drax) and
explanations for the positive, or a Hudson Valley -type thing,...
(Drax) with lots
of positives and few explanations. This one has...
(Drax) long lists
of items in both columns. Its damned peculiar. GA
(Wedge) By the
way....
(Wedge) Smith
wants to put Lake Erie in his UNICAT system.
He thinks it
(Wedge) is a very
good case. There will be an Ohio
symposium in October
(Wedge) of this
year. We are getting our people
together. Also,
(Wedge) had an
Abductee report from Stan Goredon. That
was given to
(Wedge) the State
guy in charge. Things seem to be picking
up again.ga
(Drax) You guys
chat, I gotta go 10-100.
(Wedge) PISS
(DON) I was just
notified yesterday...
(DON) by a person
at the Fair, of a friend, women, professional driver,
(DON) that had a
sighting here in Id, that looks like poss.....
(DON)
abduction. about 1 hour and half
missing..
(DON) to get more
info tomorrow, when she will have "victim"..
(DON) call. Will set up appoitment, and talk to her. ga
(Wedge) You
know....
(Wedge) Jim had a
good point on the withholding of info by the
(Wedge)
investigators. It would be nice for the
"RICHH GUYS" such as
(Wedge) Hopkins,
Striebler, etc., to have ssome sort of an answering
(Wedge) seervice
so that people investigating missing time
(Wedge) reports
could find out if they are on the right track because
(Wedge) because
of what they know. Too much money.
(Drax) Oh, by the
way, may I present Jim Delton, ParaNet Alpha's resident
skeptic.
(Wedge) Let Jim
talk
(Wedge) Jim D.,
that is
(Jim) I would
like to know
(Jim) all of the
stuff that isn't known about GB..
(Jim) Why lmust
Mr. Ed's..
(Jim) criminal
backgrd, if he has one, be shrouded in mystery?
(Jim) I also..
(Jim) Wonder
about the quality of the research done by either...
(Jim) Tracy or by
Klass because if there is a question raised by the..
(Jim) urinalysis
they BOTH should be aware of it if they are going to ..
(Jim) profess to
be experts on the case. I do not claim
to be an..
(Jim) expert,
only to have read the book by Klass, but it is..
(Jim) one of the
few items of physcial evidence in the whole case.
(Drax) I must
admit, I was rather surprised by Tracy's answers...
(Drax) to all
your questions, Jim.
(Drax) GA Dale
(Wedge) The time
that you will see Ed, in all of his glory...........
(Wedge) will be
on a book tour. I still loove to sit
back and see the
(Wedge) Hopkiins
tapes when he says only a hand full of people who have
(Wedge) been
abducted have come forward...I have seen enough
(Wedge) to count
on both hands, toes, and any other thing protruding...
(Wedge) come on
Hopkins, you made your money, give us the info we need
(Wedge) to see if
our cases are as ggood or as bad as the onees youhave
(Wedge)
inveestigated.ga
(Gerry) Can
someone straighten me out on Dulce? ...
(Drax) Well, to
be fair, Hopkins is speaking comparatively, based on how...
(Drax) many
people he BELIEVES have actually been abducted....
(Jim) Lear says
millions
(Drax) On Ed's
criminal background, there is a reason for shrouding that...
(Drax) in
mystery, and that is that it is NOT significant, if what I hear
about it...
(Jim) well...
(Drax) is true.
Don't forget, the guy is still opting for anonymity, and if...
(Drax) it should
come out who he is by accident, he may lose his business. GA
(Jim) IF it...
(Jim) is not
significant, what;s the big deal and you don't have to say who he ..
(Jim) is to say
what the crime was unless it is such a strange..
(Jim) crime that
telling would identify.
(Drax) No, I wont
say who he is, but someone else might, and he chooses NOT...
(Mike) Gerry, read
page 578 in UFO CRash
(Drax) to have
that made public. Besides, one thing I've been...
(Drax) skeptical
about is "where are all the other witnesses?" Well, it seems...
(Drax) there are
many after all, and so one mysterious rap decades ago...
(Drax) is, to me,
insignificant. GA
(Bert) Jim....
(DON) Speaking as
a policeman
(DON) if you have
a child molester living in the area
(DON) and if
children are molested...
(DON) he is
questioned. So, if EDwas arrested for
fraud, or bunko...
(DON) it would
only be proper procedure to know if this
(DON) could be
the case.
(Drax) No.
Nothing like that. It was mere teenage mischief.
(Wedge) Criminal
Mischief - First Degree Misdemeanor
(Jim) IF...
(Jim) so then
what is the big deal? But don't violate
any confidences
(Drax) Alas, I
already have. And it gained you nothing.
(Jim) Well..
(Jim) It woesn't
affect my opinon either though
(DON) Hey
Drax....
(DON) lets play
"I've got a SECRET".
(Wedge) Wait.....
(Wedge)
Everybody......
(Wedge) What
percentagee would you puton GB being
real! Vote now.
(Wedge) 20%
(Drax) 50%
(Bert) 99%
(DON) 0%
(Drax) Cops
always vote in a block. <grin>
(Gerry) 86.4%
(Gerry) No, 7%
(Wedge) Jim D?
(Jim) someone who
knows his mind..
(Jim) I was the
34.6789%
(Gerry) 86.4% is
the most significant number
(Gerry) 7 is the
most secret
(Drax) Don, I
don't like the secrets game either....
(Drax) but
sometimes its gotta be played...
(Wedge) OK....
(Wedge) Can we
quick poll?
(Drax) AS LONG AS
the negatives eventually DO come out, along with the
positives. GA
(Wedge) OK...
(Wedge) 3 quick
ones...
(Wedge)
Abductions....
(Drax) 70%
(DON) 85%
(Mike) 80%
(Gerry) 100%
(Mark) 70%
(Wedge) Whitley
Striebler....
(DON) what about
you Dale?
(Bert) Yeah Dale
(Wedge) How
sincere is Whitley from 0 - 100 %
(Wedge) I'm about
65
(Drax) 70%
(Gerry) 50%
(Mike) 90%
(Drax) Oh,
sincere? 100%
(DON) 30%
(Wedge) 100
(Jim) sincere is
80% did it happen in actual fact 3%
(Bert) 80%
(Wedge) But,
actually how much of it happened as written 0 - 100
(Wedge) 10%
(Gerry) 40%
(DON)
.00000000005800002144%
(Drax) What
percentage of it happened as written: maybe 40%
(Mike) in his
mind -100%
(DON) What about
you Dale?????????
(Drax) He said
10%
(Wedge) I said 10
%
(Wedge) Has
CSICOP talked about GB?
(Drax) No. Klass
called me last week...
(Drax) he hasn't
had time to really delve into it...
(Drax) he came up
with one photo...
(Drax) where the
camera was in motion, but the object wasn't blurred...
(Drax) I don't
know which one he's talking about...
(Drax) but
Maccabee says Ed was tracking the object when he snapped it. GA
(Drax) Also, I
don't think they are behind it. I asked a few questions. GA
(Wedge) Can
you....
(Wedge) with a
piece of glass,
(Wedge) project
an object in the air and photo it?
(Drax) Yes, but
that's been ruled out in many of the photos. GA
(DON) Nite all
(Wedge) Nite Don
(Jim) Gnite
(Bert) Night Don
(Drax) Nite, Don.
(Wedge) I gotta
run too....
(Wedge) the kid
needs breast feeding...
(Wedge) and the
wife is tired....
(Gerry) dale!
(Drax) Dale, you
perv!
(Wedge) talk
about flying saucers, BOY!!!
Comments
Post a Comment